LS6 Tommy said:
I looked at the Speedtech A-Arms. They're not really what I would consider a handling part. They're more or less a drag race part. You need more camber gain for a g body, not increased caster. All that does is give better straight line stability. It also make so the steering a TEEENY bit less responsive & slower.
Tommy
As mentioned before the way to change the camber gain is to raise the pivot point, not something that is commonly built into control arms. This is usually done with a taller spindle like the AFX spindle or sometimes through taller ball joints. That's the whole purpose someone early in this thread suggested going to a B body spindle, rather than simply change your upper arms for increased camber gain. Even my SPC arms which some folks seem to think are the greatest thing on the planet, use tall ball joints to increase camber gain.
Using a taller spindle to increase camber gain like the AFX spindle (that is engineered to enhance all areas of handling geometry) for a specific application requires a steering arm that is matched to that particular suspension configuration. This is one of the reasons the taller B Body spindle isn't the best idea, the steering arm is in the right place for a B Body, not a G body. If a B Body spindle was a good option we'd all have it done to our cars and aftermarket companies would base their spindles on a B Body spindle, but they don't. In the beginning days of learning how to make an old car handle it was an option people tried because there was nothing else. With modern technology and more aftermarket support it has since been put in the closet to collect spider webs. Now a days you can retain a stock spindle and increase handling capabilities with other parts. That's what I did and I keep pace with new Corvettes at autocross events with my 3800 lb station wagon.
Outside of the caster increase, Speedtech arms alone will help handling with the lighter weight, greater strength, and delrin bushings. the rest of the package such as AFX spindles only adds to that. If Speedtech arms don't help handling, then why do we sell so many and the cars they go on see noticeable improved handling characteristics, even when not used in conjunction with tall spindles?
Positive caster is a positive enhancement to handling based driving. Yes, it will make the car more stable at high speed but that's not limited to drag racing, we pro touring guys go awful fast on road courses, often faster than a lot of drag cars. Increased stability is a happy day no matter the racing venue. It also gives the driver a little more feedback so they can drive the car better, and helps the tires return straight after turning. If you think about it, it also helps increase camber gain as you turn. Most new cars are 5+ degrees of positive caster. G bodies aren't near that from the factory. Handling type race cars use up to 10 degrees. The Speedtech arms put it right around 5, a decent increase over stock. It's just another part of the equation to better handling. If you google whether caster enhances handling and is important to a good handling car there's plenty of info on race orientated web sites, you just have to look for it.
Remember, most aftermarket "pro Touring" parts aren't reinventing the wheel and making proprietary secret magical new parts that make a car turn better. They for the most part simply bring old crappy outdated geometry and suspension ideas up to modern engineering specs. Why do you think pro touring muscle cars are so often compared to the handling of a new BMW for example? Because they both now have similar geometry specs and therefore handle in a similar manner. It's not rocket science.
Speedtech manufactures and sells our arms from our facility right here in southern Utah. Speedway doesn't sell our parts if that's what you meant. They're black and made of round tubing, but that's likely the only similarity to ours. The Speedway arms have different widths because the cars they go on turn left... a lot.
Our arms are on sale right now, $500 off if you buy the "Pro Touring" package which consists of uppers, lowers, double adjustable coilover shocks, and billet tie rod sleeves. Gotta get 'em before the end of July though.
78-88 G Body Pro Touring Suspension
As a G Body owner I feel I have the right to say this. Quit being cheap. Yes these parts are expensive. A lot of research testing and development goes into these parts to make them do what they do. Labor and materials cost money, they aren't given to the companies that make performance parts. There seems to be a serious stigma with us G body guys- we'd rather scour the junkyard to find crappy outdated rusty worn out parts to put on our cars than save a few bucks and upgrade to a tried and true aftermarket part. I've been there and done that, and in a lot of ways it's stupid. I sure never got the results I have now by going this route. I don't have any more money than a lot of you guys, but I did my homework, saved some money and bought what I thought was the best parts that I could afford at the time. That's why my car handles like a Corvette, which is what I wanted it to do. We gotta get out of this mindset that "parts are too expensive, so instead of doing it right I'll try to find a band aid to put on the arm a shark just bit off." You're right they are expensive, but if you wanna play, you gotta pay right? BTW, buying cheap Chinese knock off parts from ebay is stupid too. You get what you pay for and if you put cheap garbage on your car your car gives you cheap garbage handling.
Sorry if I come across like I'm ticked off, I'm not. I just hate to see people get disappointed or cut themselves short by buying junk that doesn't work. No offense to you either Tommy. I work for Speedtech and I believe in the company and the parts we make. The guys that own/ run the company aren't out to get rich, if they were they'd do something else. Our goal here is to create old cars that handle well, bottom line end of story. It's also our goal to do it without charging the types of prices some of our competitors do. We ALL grew up racing and know what it's like to have to spend a whole pay check on parts that give you an extra 10th or two. We understand what it's like to be on the buying end and try to give you guys the greatest value, not the cheapest part. I know we all have opinions, but opinions count more when you have tried the parts out and then say what you think. It's a crazy thing, people believe what they read on the internet and if you suggest someone's part isn't good for what it claims to be, you should really have proof rather than just opinion to back it up.
